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Musings: What’s next? What is the ideal situation to trade Marc Staal?

July 3, 2014, by

Happy Almost-Three-Day-Weekend folks. A lot has gone on in Rangerland over the past few days, so let’s get to the musings.

Did you know that Staal has brothers? (Photo by Jim McIsaac/Getty Images)

Their best and most complicated trade chip. (Photo by Jim McIsaac/Getty Images)

  • The Rangers have $14.6 million in cap space to fill six forward spots and one defense spot. If you allocate about $12 million to Derick Brassard ($4 million), Mats Zuccarello ($4.5 million) , Chris Kreider ($2 million), and John Moore ($1.5 million), that leaves $2.6 million for three forward spots. That’s not much room to work with, even if you do use kids to fill the remaining roles.
  • The Rangers said that they want to add one more forward, but don’t know if they will sign someone or trade for someone. If they sign a forward, it’s going to have to be another experimental forward, like Benoit Pouliot last summer.
  • Mike Ribeiro is the name that will probably be thrown around a lot, as he was just bought out by Phoenix and could come cheap. I’d venture a guess that he would settle for a Brad Richards deal (one-year, $2 million). That’s as cheap as they come, but Ribiero hasn’t exactly lit the world on fire lately.
  • Aside from Ribeiro, the other UFAs are either too expensive or not intriguing: David Legwand, Derek Roy, Steve Ott, Saku Koivu, Michal Handzus. None of these guys fit (from a cap perspective or from a talent perspective).

  • That makes me think there’s a trade coming. But the problem here, again, is the cap. The Rangers would need to deal some salary in order to bring in a piece, but their only two legitimate trade chips are Marc Staal and Carl Hagelin (to a lesser extent: Derick Brassard).
  • Trading Hagelin is an option, but not a very good option. His cap hit is small, and the Rangers wouldn’t get a smaller cap hit in return.
  • Brassard will likely get a $4 million cap hit, but it’s unlikely the Rangers would be able to trade him for a comparable player with a smaller cap hit.
  • Smart GMs don’t make trades that open up other holes in the roster. Trading Staal for a forward opens up a hole on the second pairing that John Moore can’t fill. If you’re expecting a kid to fill that role, you’re grasping at straws.
  • More on trading Staal: It’s feasible you can trade him for a young F and young D. Dallas needs some help on defense. Perhaps a deal can be swung centered around Staal? Antoine RousselĀ and Trevor Daley?
  • Minnesota needs D help too, but the conversation would likely begin and end with Charlie Coyle. Plus, Minny doesn’t have the tools to send two players for Staal, opening up the hole we spoke about earlier.
  • There are actually very few trading partners that make sense for the Rangers and Staal. And don’t give me that “no one is trading for him because he’s bolting to Carolina to play with his brother” crap. That’s media driven drivel. This isn’t the NBA, players don’t plot to play with each other. They either want the paycheck or they want the Cup.
  • Question time:
    • Do you think the Rangers got better or worse after July 1?
    • How would you fill out the rest of the roster?
    • Which kids do you think make the team out of camp?
Categories : Musings


  1. SalMerc says:

    While I have no names or teams in mind, I would think we move Stall and a forward or prospect for a forward and defender. We give a 2nd pair defenseman and a 3rd/4th line forward or prospect for a 2nd line center and a 3rd pair defenseman. Essentially, deal from our strength for our weakness with a team that has an opposite situation.

  2. Johnny Red says:

    The only way for us to fill these roles is for the young kids to step up and grab the chance they have. In this cap era it’s what must be done. We have some good prospects and they need a chance. Look around the league and you’ll see a few young guys on teams. It’s the only way to go these days.
    I’m a Ranger fan since 1962 and I like that these teams are forced to give the young kids the chance because of the cap. Let’s not forget Stralman was a nobody 2 years ago and so was Pouliot.These guys can be replaced!! LET’S GO RANGERS!!!!!!!!!!

  3. Snake says:

    A1: I think it’s WAY TOO early to say if the Rangers got better or worse on 7/1. The obvious answer is worse because their 4th Line, which was a major strength and worked great with AV’s philosophy of rolling four lines has been downgraded. D-Boy is old, expensive and hurts the D vs Strahlman. All that said, it’s still Day One. When training camp opens I expect the Rangers will address some of those issues and we’ll have a better idea of where the team stands relative to last season.

    A2: Without knowing what Sather and AV know/plan, I can’t say what I would do. I would have taken a different approach to the signings so far, but I’m not an insider so I don’t know why they did things like let Dorsett walk and sign Glass.

    If it was my team, I’d have made signing a 1st line forward priority #1. Once I had that piece in place, then everyone else gets their contracts. Nash without a true 1st line center is wasted talent. If I couldn’t get a 1st line center for him, then I’d be looking at dealing Nash. This team still can’t shoot. That’s their biggest issue. They need someone better then Step to allow their top wingers to get better opportunities.

    A3: I think Miller and Fast will make it out of camp if Miller isn’t traded. I don’t know where he will slot in, but I think he’s ready.

    As Ranger fans I think we are seeing the downside of the Cap even when you are just trying to maintain what you already have. As was said somewhere else, in this new reality you have to be able to build from within. That’s your only real option to replace players when they become too expensive. Signing old players even at reasonable prices will only set you back. You gotta spend most of your salary on STAR caliber players, then fill out the rest with your prospects. Considering the Rangers have dealt away so many top picks, they are in for a really tough time trying to stay as strong as they have been in the past over the next 5 seasons.

    That, my friends, is called parity.

    • Walt says:

      That is the main reason you never trade away your #1 picks year in, and year out!!!!!!!~

      • scrangersfan says:

        I totally agree with you Walt, it seems that the Rangers are always in the re-act role rather than a planning mode. Very frustrating to a fan.

  4. wwpd says:

    off topic but, $2M for kreider sounds like a bargain basement price. that’s around the same number as dubinsky and anisimov got on their second Ranger contracts, and kreider is widely viewed as having the greater upside to be an impact player than those two guys.

    is $2M really feasible? i would have thought his next deal would look much more like marc staal’s contract

  5. Spozo says:

    I just don’t see Zuke getting 4.5 million per year. Do you see him even getting as much as the Poulliot deal? Personally I think 3.5 is the max AAV he gets.

    • mr.mister says:

      He’s a 4 a year guy, but when you see what other guys get puh… Helping the team as he does, zucc can switch salary with Nash.

      • Sally says:

        I think if Zuccs doesn’t get between 4 and 4.5, you are going to see a very unhappy Zuccs on the ice next year. He was the Rangers best playmaker last year.

    • scrangersfan says:

      On the contrary, the only player I would sign is Zucc without too much squabble because he’d been proven to be an excellent forward (the best on the Rangers) and if they pay Nash 8 million a year then Zucc is more then wordy of 5 million. He is bar far better then Nash will ever be. His attitude, his toughness and his determination to succeeded is second to none. I would like to have 12 forwards just like Zuccarello on the rangers.

  6. Chris F says:

    1) Clearly worse, for too many reasons to list here (they’ve been discussed ad nauseam the past several days here, and if people still don’t see it, they won’t until this mess hits the ice).

    2) I would explore signing Devin Setoguchi to a 1-year deal, both to better fill Pouliot’s hole and to provide some competition for the kids. Setoguchi is a RH winger, 27 years old, who’s had a 30-30 season in the past. He’d be a low-risk signing that could very well pan out the way Pouliot did. I’d then hope to God that Miller-Lindberg-Moore can find a way to establish some bottom 6 depth down the middle. I wouldn’t oppose a Klein/Staal/McIlrath trade if it brought back some useful pieces.

    3) Fast, Miller, and Lindberg could all make the team this camp barring some major additions to the roster. Haggerty is also a dark-horse, along with Connor Allen if we trade one of our defensemen.

  7. Walt says:

    The team isn’t as good as it was before 7/1! B Boyle will be missed for his PK, and defensive play. As for the rest who went, good luck to them!!

    Miller, Lindberg, and either Fast, or Haggerty make the team out of camp.

    I’d move Stall for a good return, only because we have some young d-men in the pipeline who should be ready real soon!!

    • MBN says:

      Forgot about Haggerty. Good choice!!

    • scrangersfan says:

      I would not move Stall. We already last Stralman and to trade Stall would decimate the team. Defense was our heart and soul and to dismember it would be disastrous

  8. Chris F says:

    When is the deadline for teams to sign their RFAs?

    When can other teams begin discussions with them?

    Under what circumstances can RFAs sign with other teams (is it only through QOs)?

    Just wondering what it might take to pry Brandon Sutter away and add him to the line with Hagelin and MSL.

    • Chris A says:

      RFAs are available as of July 1 just like all other FAs.

      The QO is merely a formality to retain an RFAs rights. Like tendering vs. non-tendering in MLB. Without a QO (Qualifying Offer) a player becomes a UFA, like Del Zotto this summer.

      As far as Sutter coming to the Rangers, it’s impossible. The Rangers don’t have their own first round pick to offer as compensation in case Pittsburgh refused to match. Also, compensation is determined by the cap hit of the offer sheet. There is a simple table that breaks down cap hits into brackets and where that cap hit falls determines compensation.

      Now, if the Rangers were able to trade Pitt for Sutter’s rights it’s a different story, then he would become the Rangers’ RFA.

      • Chris F says:

        Brain cramp. I meant Offer Sheet, not QO.

        So, I guess my question is, at what point can a player choose not to re-sign with a team if he’s an RFA? Is he absolutely locked in absent an Offer Sheet or arbitration?

        • Chris A says:

          Ah ok. Well yeah, if there are no offer sheets then a player is stuck. His only option is to hold out at that point.

  9. howiehockey says:

    Whoa, Whoa, Whoa guys…some suggestions were alright, but you are all missing the point. To paraphrase former President Clinton, It’s the salary stupid. Out side of Henrik who has the most salary on the club. C’mon you guys are dying to say it NASH! NASH! NASH!
    Sather and company have to get him to waive his no movement clause. Nash for all his shortcomings is still a valuable commodity. But to rich for the Rangers as comprised today.
    I’ll bet there are teams out there that will take him…how about Nash & Klein to Yotes for Yandle and a draft pick. It’s possible. I’m sure there are other alternatives.

  10. John C says:

    Frans Nielsen (NYI, $2.75MM/AAV, next two seasons)?

    It’d be trading within the division (first mistake), and gifting the Isles with the experienced Defenseman they’re seeking (second mistake), but it’s a beautiful cap hit for a Center who consistently produces.

    I’m a huge Zucc fan, but he isn’t worth $4.5MM. Brass definitely isn’t worth $4MM. The $2MM Kreider, and $1.5MM J.Moore deals sound great though!

    • Chris F says:

      My Isles buddy has been pitching me of Nielsen all week. And, while I’d definitely be interested (depending on what the Isles want in return), I heard today that Snow came out and said Nielsen is a sure part of the team’s future.

      Looks like they may shop Bailey or Grabner for a defenseman.

      • John C says:

        Bailey & Grabner are depth players, but unless they’re packaged, I don’t see anything.

        All players are part of the teams’ future unless the right pieces are offered in a trade. It’s all a game.

  11. howiehockey says:

    BTW, I do agree that Setoguchi might be away to go.

  12. bloomer says:

    The rangers are about the with the moves they made…I like their pp improves but concerned about the pk with boyne gone. I give the rookies a legit shot…I believe fast and miller are ready for prime time. Rangers could use another pivot.

  13. Frank Cerbone says:

    Yes, like I posted weeks ago, Setoguchi is an option; but he needs to take a pay cut.

    Hagelin is not going anywhere. Could you imagine Hagelin & Stralman both leaving the Rangers, Lundquist would have a stroke & Montreal will have singing and dancing in the streets. PK Subban was taken out of the playoffs by Hagelin’s forchecking.

    Hagelin is an impossible to replace even strength goal scorer.

    Yup, moving Staal is the way to go.

    • scrangersfan says:

      And don’t forget Hagelin’s speed. He is dangerous on a short handed breakaway.

  14. Shawn ferris says:

    Brassard and choice of either Klein or staal plus prospect and picks depending on the choice of Klein or staal for joe Thornton. 34 years old and in great shape, look at what some other “aging” stars have done the last few years. This deal would increase cap space and hopefully wake up Rick Nash. Sin Diaz and make him into the d man that we have seen flashes of. Hagelin Stepan St. Louis, Kreider Thornton Nash or move Nash over to left side and move zucc up, Kreider up and put Hagelin on 3rd line with fast and miller. Mcdonagh girardi, Moore Boyle, Klein (staal) Diaz. Sounds good to me

  15. Frank Cerbone says:

    Trade for 34 yr old Thorton? Manybe for St Louis or Nash?

    Wait a minute Thorton scored 7 goals last year.
    Have San Jose throw in a #1 for St Louis or San Joss EAT ALL OF NASH’s CONTRACT