What is a fair asking price for Kevin Shattenkirk

The more the offseason progresses, the more we hear about the Rangers and their desire to move on from Kevin Shattenkirk. Larry Brooks went as far as saying the Blueshirts would consider buying him out, something I consider to be asinine. Even with that contract, there has to be value there. For what it’s worth, here’s the buyout cost:

  • 2019-2020: $1.483m cap hit
  • 2020-2021: $6.083m cap hit
  • 2021-2022: $1.433m cap hit
  • 2022-2023: $1.433m cap hit

That 2020-2021 cap hit is because his salary that year is all in bonuses, a lockout proof year in his deal, the last year of his deal. In terms of cap space, the Rangers would save $5 million this season and $500k next season. There is no legitimate reason to buy him out.

The most likely situation is a 50% retained trade, which means the receiving team gets Shattenkirk at two years and $3.3 million. Certainly more manageable than $6.6 million. Since any acquiring team is likely both competing and in need of cap space, it makes for the potential to add a 40-50 point defenseman — when used properly — who improves the powerplay and drives offense. There’s significant value there.

How significant is the question, though. It’s a safe assumption that Shattenkirk, who has a 10 team no trade list (and full no-move protection against the expansion draft and waivers), will be dealt at the draft. Finding comparable trades is a little difficult.

The Erik Karlsson trade doesn’t match up, and neither does the Dougie Hamilton trade. Aside from those two, there aren’t many non-trade deadline deals involving defensemen comparable to Shattenkirk. It’s actually a barren wasteland, since most trades involving any player with salary are either cap dump trades, which the Rangers don’t need to do, or trades to Vegas.

Let’s be a little creative here and throw out a hypothetical, since it’s crazy season. And remember, my trade proposal sucks. Let’s include Shattenkirk in the deal for Jacob Trouba. Shattenkirk at 50% retained, Vesey, and Howden for Trouba and Kulikov, with the Rangers buying out Kulikov. That’s a lot of salary space for Winnipeg for Laine/Connor, plus role players to fill out the roster and a young center with potential. The Rangers get their 25 year old 1RD for what amounts to minimal cost to their rebuild.

I’ll throw one more hypothetical at you, involving our old friends in Tampa. If they miss out on Erik Karlsson, could they look at a retained Shattenkirk as a decent secondary option? Shattenkirk at 50% for Ryan Callahan (cap dump, Rangers can buy him out if need be), a draft pick, and their #3 prospect Boris Katchouk? Gives them a cheap RD to slide in behind Hedman without blocking Cal Foote’s path or giving up Foote, Volkov, or Cirelli. The Rangers get another solid prospect.

Being creative can be fun, right?

"What is a fair asking price for Kevin Shattenkirk", 2 out of 5 based on 18 ratings.

123 thoughts on “What is a fair asking price for Kevin Shattenkirk

  • Jun 7, 2019 at 6:48 am
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    I’d take a #175, and the time of day for him in a heart beat!!!!!!!

    On a serious note, I’d make either trade, as long as we get rid of this guy, I don’t care……

  • Jun 7, 2019 at 7:11 am
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    40-50 point dman? Those days are long over. I would take a 3rd or 4th plus retaining 40% to move him.

  • Jun 7, 2019 at 8:02 am
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    Here are the givens – we will retain 50% salary and you give us something back as a gesture of good faith. Here is mine – Shatty & Pionk or Vesey & the 20th pick for Trouba. Remember they need to move Trouba as much as we need to move Shatty.

  • Jun 7, 2019 at 8:05 am
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    Shatty isn’t going anywhere. He and Stall are here to stay. Concentrate on moving Smith, Pionk and maybe Skjei. Let these two old vets provide some veteran leadership in the clubhouse. They can play 3rd pair minutes, Open 2 spots for kids.

    See if anyone will take a flyer on Skjei. That is a bit of money to clear too.

    • Jun 7, 2019 at 9:10 am
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      I don’t believe that Skjei is going anywhere. Pershaps he is moved if they get a first pair defender in return.

    • Jun 7, 2019 at 9:55 am
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      Shatty is going to be the first one out the door

      • Jun 7, 2019 at 10:23 am
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        And that would be another dumb move by Rangers management. Staal is easily worse than Smith and Shattenkirk. He should be the first one bought out. You only move Shattenkirk if you get a good return. I would either keep Smith as the 7th defenseman or bury him in Hartford in case of injuries. All of these prospects aren’t making the team.

        • Jun 7, 2019 at 10:53 am
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          Please tell me what 22 brings to the table? He is slow soft can’t play a lick of defense and has that pattented weak wrist shot that never gets through. It was a dumb move to even sign him

          • Jun 7, 2019 at 11:40 am
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            Before he got hurt he was producing as expected. His knee injury has derailed his Rangers career. Actually his contract was a bargain if you look at what offensive defenseman get.

            I answered you now answer me. What does Staal bring to the table? How is he better to keep around then Shattenkirk?

            • Jun 7, 2019 at 12:16 pm
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              Staal can play defense

              • Jun 7, 2019 at 3:00 pm
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                I hope that’s a joke. Staal is easily the worst defenseman on the Rangers. Even those who don’t like Shattenkirk realize Staal is a disaster

              • Jun 7, 2019 at 3:29 pm
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                Staal is shot and I hope he is bought out….With that said I would rather have him out there battling in the corners than Shattypants

  • Jun 7, 2019 at 8:19 am
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    This is nuts, let’s talk about JD laying out the plan for Hartford. That presser was monumental. We haven’t had that in Rangers-town for as long as I can remember.

    HIs words were very carefully chosen. He was direct while being excited and transparent. I’m just so happy he’s the new boss.

  • Jun 7, 2019 at 9:29 am
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    I just don’t get the Shatty hate. Guy came here at a discount, played with an injury that management was horribly irresponsible for allowing, and still put up decent points.

    Last year wasn’t great, but he was still – offensively and defensively – than Staal, Smith, McQuaid, and Pionk.

    Trade him with salary retained because ADA can do his job better and because you want to open up ice time for others. I’m on board with that, ut the hate is misguided.

    • Jun 7, 2019 at 9:57 am
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      He sucks…hence the hate. His injury was a meniscus…that’s a month not 2 years

    • Jun 7, 2019 at 11:33 am
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      The question was, is, and always be why the hell they signed him in the first place? Sorry he came at a discount because no one else would have that crap…………..

      • Jun 7, 2019 at 1:05 pm
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        If he came at a discount wouldn’t that mean someone offered him more? As to why they signed him, they thought they could compete for the SC and his credentials were such that he could “add” something to that team — a PP QB on the right side. Circumstances changed and his “purpose” and skill set, which has deteriorated over the course of the last 2 years, is no longer useful. Mistakes happen, it was still a better signing than say Wade Redden. 😉

        • Jun 7, 2019 at 2:04 pm
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          The man sucked in St Lewis, got worse in Washington to the point that the coach stated as much, and your defending the fool, sorry my man you can’t judge quality, vs crap at all!!!!!!!!

          As for Redden, at least we got a season, or to before he collapsed, vs this guy who was garbage from day one. Don’t even try to tell me about his knee injury because I had both knees replaced, but before then, both had meniscus tears, and I bounced back with in weeks of the surgery, while he took off two seasons already. Sorry my man, he sucks donkey di*k!!!!!!!!!

          • Jun 7, 2019 at 4:05 pm
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            Valter, relax. I merely gave you the rationale for the move, I don’t want him around — and Redden’s contract was for 6 years, not 4 … so yes, it was WORSE. 🙂

          • Jun 7, 2019 at 6:07 pm
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            So you bounced back and played NHL hockey? He also didn’t take off two seasons and the additional damage done having him play half a season with the injury compounded the problem. Shatty’s stats refute your ‘sucked in St Louis’’ narrative as well, but don’t let any stupid facts get in the way of your opinions.

          • Jun 7, 2019 at 10:28 pm
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            He was good on St. Louis and his first season with the Rangers until his injury. I don’t judge players on a 19 game stretch on a new team. Rentals don’t work out sometimes. It happens. Look at Kevin Hayes in Winnipeg as an example.

            Well since you had two knee injuries and bounced back quickly that must mean everyone does. Injuries effect people differently. Some people heal faster then others. Also he plays a physical sport that puts a lot more wear and tear on your body.

            You will find any reason to attack players you don’t like even if its a stupid reason like comparing knee injuries. His defensive metrics actually show he was one of the most effective defenseman on this team. But continue believing what you want.

            • Jun 7, 2019 at 10:52 pm
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              James

              If you go back to before he was signed with us I was saying the same thing, he can’t play a lick of defense, and nothing has changed since he came. As a matter of fact, he got worse.

              If you don’t care for my posts, do me, and your stomach a favor, don’t read them, and save yourself from getting an ulcer……….

    • Jun 7, 2019 at 1:19 pm
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      Shatty’s greatest asset is his skating:

      Year #1, he hurts his KNEE and CONTINUES to play on it, even though the team knew that he should have been on the shelf and had surgery in OCTOBER, not towards the end of that season.

      So, after having surgery, he spends most of Year #2 just getting back his SKATING that he had before the KNEE injury. Lo and behold, at the END of Year #2, he was just starting to play much better.

      Add to that, the RANGERS changed direction of the team AFTER Shatty signed, and was not as good a fit for Shatty than it would have been if the team had been kept intact.

      It’s not rocket science people.

      So, I agree, this piling on Shatty is too simplistic for what actually occurred, including all circumstances.

      • Jun 7, 2019 at 1:23 pm
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        Agreed Tony.

      • Jun 7, 2019 at 1:38 pm
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        He was dreck with the Caps my friend

        • Jun 7, 2019 at 1:41 pm
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          I’m not disputing that, but everyone has to stop thinking that this guy was an elite D man. He’s not, never was, never will.

          $6.5M per is for “good” D men that can put up some pts. $11M per is for D men like Burns who can put up 80 pts and for stupid teams like the Kings (Doughty), who is already trying to trade Drew to get away from that contract.

          • Jun 7, 2019 at 1:50 pm
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            haha I question someones knowledge of the game if they put 22 in the Elite column

            • Jun 7, 2019 at 1:58 pm
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              It’s too easy to say someone “sucks.” Maybe he does, but consider the circumstances as well.

              Like I said yesterday, and no one liked it, lol, I’m on the fence with him for this year.

              • Jun 7, 2019 at 2:02 pm
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                I hear ya buddy

              • Jun 7, 2019 at 4:53 pm
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                What do you think the chances of Shattenkirk being moved Tony? I think you only move him if you get a good deal. Definitely don’t go the buy out route.

                Also I don’t think its a sure thing Shattenkirk is a goner. Davidson was the guy who traded for Shattenkirk while President of the Blues. I wouldn’t be surprised if he gives him a chance to start the season.

              • Jun 7, 2019 at 5:00 pm
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                James, I think the answer to that is if the Rangers get a Trouba or someone like that.

                If they do, then Shatty would be a goner. If not, I think that he stays.

                I think the FO thinks the basic same opinion as I do, or more correctly, me with them, I think they’re on the fence. They are probably shopping him, but that doesn’t mean trading him.

                Or more to the point, there are more players available for the right price than not. The Rangers are actively talking. Everything is on the table.

        • Jun 7, 2019 at 4:50 pm
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          So he was bad with the Capitals for 19 games and all of a sudden he’s terrible player. He was good with the Blues and his first season as a Rangers before he got hurt. I would take that track record versus a small 19 game sample size.

          • Jun 7, 2019 at 4:57 pm
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            He went from 1st pair to 3rd when Parayako came on board, the move to the Caps cemented what was obvious(to anybody paying attention.)

      • Jun 7, 2019 at 4:37 pm
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        Agreed Tony, he was brought in to do one thing — provide 40-50 points on the right side specializing on QBing the PP. In his 1st year here he had 23 points in 46 games, works out to 41 for a full season — on a bad knee. He had 12 points on the PP which translates to approximately 23 for a full season which is barely below his career average — again, on a bad knee.

        2nd year, well as you stated, we changed direction … and his time on the PP diminished and he was supplanted first by Pionk, and then both he and Pionk were supplanted by Tony D.

        Put him on a more mature team next year (assuming the knees are 100%) and I wouldn’t be surprised if he scored 45+ points with 20-25 of them coming on the PP.

        • Jun 7, 2019 at 4:41 pm
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          While being -145 playing 5 on 5………The guy stinks, I can smell him thru my computer!!!!!!

          • Jun 8, 2019 at 6:41 am
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            lol, easy bro, easy….

        • Jun 7, 2019 at 5:02 pm
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          Perfect tanto, agreed.

    • Jun 7, 2019 at 1:24 pm
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      half these guys have convinced themselves NY is icing 4 out of 7 rookie defensemen. with 2 more up front… and an back-up from time to time. and they’ll do it all season.

      That’s the reason for the hate. and thankfully we know that will never happen.

      • Jun 7, 2019 at 2:08 pm
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        My man, if they out play them, then they deserve to play. End of discussion!!!!!!!

      • Jun 7, 2019 at 4:44 pm
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        That’s why I don’t see Shattenkirk, Smith and Staal all being gone. Someone has to fill out the roster. Keeping Shattenkirk paired with Skjei, Smith as the 7th defenseman or buried in Hartford and Staal being the one bought out help ease the rookies onto the team.

        • Jun 7, 2019 at 5:28 pm
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          Can’t see them buying out Staal, just can’t.

          • Jun 7, 2019 at 6:11 pm
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            Agreed – sad to say as it’s dead wrong – but agreed.

        • Jun 8, 2019 at 6:46 am
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          All 3 will not be gone.

          It will be interesting to see what happens with Staal, as he no longer has Sather protecting him.

          Smith can be sent to Hartford, if nothing else, but let’s see about Staal where the only real option is to buy him out.

          I really wonder if Carolina would take Staal, at half cap hit, along with a draft pick. I doubt it because they have a really good D, but does a Staal (50% retained cap hit), Georgiev, Andersson, and 2nd round pick get us Hamilton? Btw, that’s not a lot for Hamilton, he’s a very good D man.

  • Jun 7, 2019 at 9:42 am
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    20-21 can’t be all bonuses, need to have $700k in Paragraph 1 salary.

    Otherwise, point taken.

    Retained salary deal this year or July 2 deal next.

    • Jun 7, 2019 at 2:20 pm
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      Was the lockout protection provision (compromise) the “discount” that was said he gave to the team? Because for the life of me I couldn’t see Shattenkirk getting 7 mil per year from any team, especially when he was getting a reputation over his poor defensive play. I thought 6.65 million was pretty fair.

    • Jun 7, 2019 at 3:17 pm
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      According to Cap Friendly, This year is all salary for $6mm; 20-21 is only $2mm signing bonus and $2mm salary.

      The discount was the front ended nature of the contract.

      For a 50% retainer, the trading team spends $4mm even if there isn’t a season in 20-21.

      So there’s no great deal for a team beyond expected value and downside risk of kicking out a bonus for the last year when he might not play.

      Conditional 7th with upside if he performs to get it to a 3rd.

  • Jun 7, 2019 at 10:06 am
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    I agree Duncan.

    The dude came here with a decent pedigree – and being a decent defender was not part of it. He is what has been advertised, a good puck carrier and a Power Play QB. The problem is that the NYR have nobody on D that is decent, so they all suffer.

    There is a lot of shaking out to be done with the bodies they have. Some have to go just to make room for the up and coming guys – Fox, Hajek, Lindgren, Rykov. I would let that all play out before dumping Shatty. Let’s see what difference a new season brings and then reassess at the trade deadline when his value will be high.

    I just do not understand why the NYR would pay money to make him go away.

    As unpopular as that stance is – I also do not think it is smart to expend assets to get Trouba when he can be had for free next July. Again, let’s see what these young guys bring to the table before we start dumping good assets like a #1 pick (or any of the four D-men named above) for someone who is UFA in one year and wants to come here anyway.

    • Jun 7, 2019 at 10:21 am
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      If Shatty is “what has been advertised, a good puck carrier and a Power Play QB,” I have no words. His performance on the PP has been abysmal by any metric. But don’t take it from me —- take it from the man himself this past season when he spoke to the media after being healthy-scratched, most recently in March.

      Had Shatty never gone to Washington and showed the world there just what he is, on a Cup-contending team — in Trotz’s lingo, much more a 3-4 Dman than a 1-2 — then I could more readily accept the decision to sign him. But his performance in DC (other than that one overtime goal) was deficient in every aspect of the sort of game a truly top defender needs to have.

      • Jun 7, 2019 at 10:57 am
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        100% agree….Shattenkirk compounded his problem when he got hurt prob half assed rehab

    • Jun 7, 2019 at 3:31 pm
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      So you are saying Shatty needs good players around him to make him look good? kinda like St. Louis

    • Jun 7, 2019 at 4:57 pm
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      Swarty,I also agree with Duncan and yourself on all the points you added,also want to give you props for your call last season for JD for president,you were one of if not the only to make this call,at the time I wasn’t on board,I’m on board now,good call.

      • Jun 7, 2019 at 7:11 pm
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        Thanks Misconduct. Appreciate that. Very good memory by the way.

        I was going to remind everyone that I was the first one to tag JD as the move to make, but I think you just did that for me…:)

        • Jun 7, 2019 at 8:32 pm
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          You’re welcome,have to give credit where credit is due.

    • Jun 7, 2019 at 4:59 pm
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      Sometimes you have to clear the decks to make room for the next generation.

      ADA’s play warrants doing so once they get him signed long term.

      • Jun 7, 2019 at 5:29 pm
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        I have no problem clearing the decks,start with Staal & Smith!!!

        • Jun 7, 2019 at 5:57 pm
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          I would keep Smith as a 12F, PK-D until next year.

          • Jun 7, 2019 at 7:39 pm
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            Yes

          • Jun 7, 2019 at 8:44 pm
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            I wouldn’t be opposed to keeping Smith as our 12-13th forward if we can’t move him in a trade(unlikely),but he’s pretty expensive for that role,Staal on the other hand has to go,I’d be very surprised if he’s not bought out,retaining 50% salary is never a good idea.

            • Jun 7, 2019 at 8:56 pm
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              Almost never.

    • Jun 8, 2019 at 6:50 am
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      Depends what the assets are to get Trouba.

      If it’s the 20th pick, which I assume is a must in this deal, and Andersson, and Pionk, then you do the deal.

      But it appears like Chevy on the Jets wants the top young players, which is a non-starter for the Rangers. JD is not caving to anyone at this point, because, he’s a true, smart hockey guy.

      We’re in good hands with JD.

  • Jun 7, 2019 at 10:14 am
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    I don’t want to give up on Howden, aside from that I like the trade proposals … BUT, do we really think Shattenkirk would approve of a trade to Winnipeg? Even Winnipeg natives don’t want to play for Winnipeg.

    • Jun 7, 2019 at 10:56 am
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      Howden is going nowhere …Kid is the goods…I suppose if its on 22’s no list…

      • Jun 7, 2019 at 11:42 am
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        Toronto is going to be in cap hello they sign Marner at $11 ish mill. Zaitsev sucks but wants to leave . They need cheap D. Kadri is on the outs and On a good contract. He’s got issues but with Shattenkirk 1/2 retained it saves the leafs just over a mill in cap and gives them a d man to help the power play. Kadri good center insurance for 2c/3c maybe we need to add more but I would imagine Shattenkirk could be convinced to go there, throw in Smith 1/2 retained and take a 2nd in 2020 too

      • Jun 7, 2019 at 12:06 pm
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        Everyone talks about Chytil, but Howden had the same number of points in less games — and looked pretty good at the beginning of the season and then again at the end, which just screams “he hit a wall” in the middle, got injured and then recovered his mojo. That is promising because it generally resolves itself with proper diet and conditioning.

        • Jun 7, 2019 at 1:31 pm
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          Howden and Chityl were both awful, so why defend one by comparing him to the other performance-wise. Chityl is a year and a half younger and hints at having elite talent. Most people pegged Howden as having the potential to be a good bottom six forward. He may still be that, but there is no indication he will be a star.

          If you keep all of the players you want to keep, the Rangers will never be any good. To get things back in trade, you need to give up players of value – hopefully players the other team overvalues. I am not arguing for selling Howden cheap, but if he makes a deal work, you part with him.

          Here is who I keep: players who are special, players who provide something the team needs (and I don’t give a damn about snarl), and players who are under-appreciated.

          • Jun 7, 2019 at 4:11 pm
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            I would say Howden has the possibility of being a 2nd line center — but “no comment” as to how good a one he could be. I never suggested he could be a STAR and to be honest, we can’t have a team made up of 20 Stars. I wish to keep him for the player he can be, even if that isn’t a star — I could say the same for a guy like Lemieux. You need players to compliment the “stars”, you need solid depth players that can take on different roles with the team.

            • Jun 7, 2019 at 5:00 pm
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              Howden is a 2C on a very bad team.

              • Jun 7, 2019 at 5:19 pm
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                Probably true which is why I said “no comment” as to how good a one he could be. So is it a bad thing if he ends up a good 3C who can sometimes move up to 2C in a pinch?

          • Jun 7, 2019 at 4:16 pm
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            Forgot to add Ray, should I remind you that Howden played the year as a 20 year old? I think you forget that a vast majority of 20 year olds haven’t even played a game in the NHL. He needs a little time to “season”.

            • Jun 7, 2019 at 6:41 pm
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              ” I think you forget that a vast majority of 20 year olds haven’t even played a game in the NHL.”

              And you forget that Howden should not have either.

              Look, my criticism was really quite simple. I really like Chityl’s talent, but frankly he sucked this year. And your defense of Howden was that he was as good as a player who sucked. That simply does not count as praise in my book. I didn’t say Howden had no future, just that he has no past.

              The Rangers were a team that lacked veteran talent and as a result played a lot of kids. Just because the kids actually played in the NHL does not mean they were any good.

        • Jun 7, 2019 at 6:17 pm
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          Howden had an unsustainable shooting percentage to start the year, got to play his natural position, was absolutely abysmal defensively, and had 1 point over a zillion game span before he broke through with a lucky deflection towards the end.

          • Jun 7, 2019 at 7:37 pm
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            He was also on a bad team…You see his talent tho…he stays

    • Jun 8, 2019 at 6:52 am
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      Again, the Jets CANNOT take salary back in any deal. They need to sign Laine, Connor, and Ehlers, which is why Trouba is a goner.

      The Jets also appear to want to retain Myers, which is another big cap hit.

  • Jun 7, 2019 at 1:33 pm
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    Dave, if you are going to buy out Kulikov, don’t you need to get the deal done before June 15?

    • Jun 7, 2019 at 5:25 pm
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      Buyout period begins June 15, ends 5:00pm New York time on June 30.

      • Jun 7, 2019 at 5:41 pm
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        Wooo Bring the noise!

      • Jun 7, 2019 at 6:32 pm
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        thanx

  • Jun 7, 2019 at 4:14 pm
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    I see some people (posters) are getting a little testy. Can’t wait for the draft so everyone can calm down — oh wait, we’re talking Ranger fans and they’ll be complaining about the draft for a week+ until we get to the opening of free agency, then they’ll complain about that for a couple of months, then … and so on, and so on …

  • Jun 7, 2019 at 4:25 pm
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    I just read a proposed trade that could make sense, and this way we add a winger, and lose a center that seems to be a fan goat.

    Jesse Puljujarvi, of the Oilers, is 6’3″, over 200 lbs, 21 years old, comes from Finland, and could fit right in if we get Kakko. Both would have a young countryman to hang with, and be buds. In exchange we give up Andersson, who seems to be in the chateaux bow wow with the Ranger faithfuls.

    We are plenty deep at center, and have a need for true wings. He, Lias, is 2 years younger than Jesse, both have been a bit disappointing for their respective teams, and both can get a new start with another franchise. I think this is a deal that is a win-win for everyone involved. Any thoughts??????

    • Jun 7, 2019 at 4:42 pm
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      … and as I commented there, if JP doesn’t develop (a Top 6 winger) he’s out of the League, if Lias doesn’t really develop he can still be a good bottom 6 center. Regardless I don’t think the Oilers make that trade, they’ll want something more.

      Just a personal opinion but I want to see one more year of Lias, where he actually gets NORMAL ice time and a chance to develop a rhythm — I’m not saying he deserved 13-15 minutes a night last season, but I’m hoping he gets that this year so we can better judge his abilities and intangibles.

      • Jun 7, 2019 at 5:04 pm
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        Puljujarvi has a skill set that will allow him to play in the league for a long time, the concern is if his mind set will allow him to do that.

        When I saw him with 97, he didn’t look out of place at all, but in case you haven’t noticed, the Oilers could screw up a 2 car parade.

        • Jun 7, 2019 at 5:24 pm
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          I agree, the skill is there … you made my point, if he doesn’t develop he’ll be out of the league. The League can tolerate a guy whose skill only develops so far IF his mind is right — that will carve you out a career in the bottom 6 … but a guy with skill whose mind is wrong will find himself out of the league after a couple of “reclamation” attempts.

        • Jun 7, 2019 at 6:23 pm
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          JP will need a real contract soon, so the Rangers will have little time to decide if he’s worth keeping. LA, on the other hand, has more cost-controlled time for the team to truly evaluate him and that in itself makes a JP for LA trade a loser for the Rangers.

          • Jun 7, 2019 at 9:42 pm
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            That certainly one aspect of such a trade, but it wouldn’t appear to be deal braking in any sense of the word. In 2 years we shed a whole lot of money — besides, given JP’s record so far I wouldn’t think he could break the bank even if he had a “breakout” year. I guess it’s an issue though if we go out and do something stupid like sign Panarin and Erik Karlsson.

      • Jun 7, 2019 at 6:30 pm
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        Come on. Lias played in Hartford last year and was one of the worst players the history of the franchise. He is nowhere near being a credible bottom six player. He is young and supposedly has talent and may develop. I don’t know what the high end estimate for him is, but the low end estimate for him is not bottom six, it is total washout.

        Andersson was a mistake. Conventional wisdom was that he was not a #7 pick, but the Rangers chose him early because he was ready to step in. It makes no sense to believe that his absence of readiness will be offset by him having more talent than expected. I looked up old forecasts and I found twelve. Average forecaster picked Lias 16.5, ranging from 11 to 26. I also looked up #16 picks 2005-2014. They ranged from Tarasenko to washout. Better ones were Tom Wilson, Nick Leddy, Nikita Zadorov.

        Incidentally, the Rangers also went somewhat off the board on their other pick. Only five of twelve picked Chityl in the first round and only one before #28. And so was Kravtsov last year.

        • Jun 7, 2019 at 6:36 pm
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          Really didn’t follow the Pack last year, but I seem to remember LA putting up decent points on a terrible team while there. Hard to believe he was even in the same galaxy as the worst players in franchise history.

          • Jun 7, 2019 at 6:53 pm
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            In 36 games, he scored 6 goals and was -24. In the last twenty years, the worst plus-minus was -46, so a pace of -2 every three games is impressive. Two players on the Pack were -26 in far more games.

            Actually, worst is hyperbole. The really bad players likely didn’t play more than a game or five.

            • Jun 7, 2019 at 7:22 pm
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              Ugh. But wasn’t everyone on that team minus 15 or more?

              Also, Hayek had a crappy stat line on that team and he looked perfectly decent on the Rangers before fate dealt him the joker.

            • Jun 8, 2019 at 12:47 am
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              … and what about Hajek? You see two can play that game. 😉

        • Jun 7, 2019 at 7:36 pm
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          Lias was a terrible pick…They missed Middlestadt Tippet Vilardi and Necas

        • Jun 8, 2019 at 7:01 am
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          Raymond, I totally agree that Andersson was not the pick at 7, but one of the worst players in franchise history? #hyperbole

          It’s easy to 2nd guess, but where I have a problem with the Rangers on this pick, is that even THEY said Andersson’s skating was “ok.” You’re picking 7 overall, the good skating box had better be checked, and in this case, it wasn’t.

          This is a classic example of Gordie thinking that he knows more than everyone else around him. Middlstat or Tippet should have been the pick at 7.

          • Jun 8, 2019 at 8:01 am
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            And Gordie has continued to keep his job with gaffe after gaffe

            • Jun 8, 2019 at 9:16 am
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              Well, we’ll see now.

              Sather steps down and Schoeny retires. Gordie is next on the list. Doesn’t pay to do something now, so close to the draft, but I would believe that his position may have a new person filling it, this time next year.

              Ruff has to go too. I can’t believe there is no one out there better than him to lead the D.

              • Jun 8, 2019 at 9:58 am
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                Let’s hope Brother

              • Jun 8, 2019 at 1:32 pm
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                So he gets no credit for Chytil and the 2018 draft? Buchnevich? No credit for signing Georgiev or drafting Shesty? Just saying, every scouting group is going to make many mistakes … the hope is they also pick some winners. Let’s remember that batting .300 (circa 30%) with draft choices is considered fine — and that’s just guys who play some in the NHL — it isn’t 30% of all draft become real good NHLers. Plus scouts are responsible for free agent signings and players obtained in trades. Drafting is just one aspect of a scouting department’s responsibility.

              • Jun 8, 2019 at 3:54 pm
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                Clark’s drafting record is ok, but he’s an “old school” thinker and that’s not what wins in the NHL now.

                He’s had almost 20 years here, it’s enough, time for new blood.

              • Jun 8, 2019 at 4:39 pm
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                Old school thinker? I think his drafting the last 2 years hardly evidences “old school” thinking … and it’s been 16 years and circa 8 months that he’s been with the Rangers, at first as just a scout — and I think the Rangers drafted pretty well under his tenure — aside from all the years we didn’t have a 1st or 2nd round draft choice. In my mind the time to fire Gordie (if there was one) was when the Rangers announced the rebuild. He’s been intimately involved in it for over 2 years now and has the trust of Gorton (they go way back), I think he deserves the opportunity to finish it — and then be judged along with Gorton on its success or failure.

              • Jun 9, 2019 at 6:05 am
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                Jessiman
                Montoya
                McIlrath
                Andersson – the jury is out but not looking like a #7 overall right now, does he?
                Stepan – traded
                JT Miller – traded

                Enough said.

                And before you say it, Hank was not Gordie’s pick. He didn’t even know who Hank was dring the draft. It was the insistence of one of their European scouts that they finally picked him in the 7th round.

    • Jun 7, 2019 at 4:43 pm
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      50% retain and a 2nd for Puljujarvi I would do in a heartbeat.

      • Jun 7, 2019 at 5:26 pm
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        I would be inclined to do that too, Shattenkirk isn’t needed and isn’t loved at the moment, a 2nd round pick is a crap shoot — and given all the picks we’ve made in the last 2 years plus the ones we’ll make this year, that late 2nd is expendable for a risky highly skilled player.

    • Jun 8, 2019 at 6:55 am
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      When Ranger fans say that we are deep at center, and I think that, we have Zib and… I wonder what that statement means, lol.

      We HAVE centers, but they’re all not NHL centers, yet. When you question who you’re 2C is because there’s not an obvious choice, then you are not deep at center.

      • Jun 8, 2019 at 8:00 pm
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        When people say “deep at center” it’s being put into the perspective of our prospects. I take it Chytil gets penciled in at the #2 center slot followed by Howden and Andersson (or Nieves) … then again we have Strome and Namestnikov that can also play center. Kravtsov has played center as well. I’m pretty sure they can craft the Center position out of what we have but it might take another year or so before someone grabs the mantle of #2 and runs with it adequately enough for us to be a good team.

        Of course just because we have this depth doesn’t mean the Rangers should pass on a better prospect who happens to be a center since guys like Kravtsov, Namestnikov and Strome have all played the wing, as well as Chytil who might benefit from another year there.

        • Jun 9, 2019 at 6:10 am
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          There’s “we have players to play center” and then there’s “how good are the players that we have playing center?”

          Zib is a given and true #1C, that we finally have.

          Putting either Chytil, Names, or Strome at 2C is a “forced” situation because SOMEBODY has to play the position.

          It’s like Parcells used to say, if you have 3 QBs to pick from then you do not have a real QB to start. So if you have 3 candidates for 2C, then you have none, in reality. We’re not talking Crosby or Malkin here, lol.

  • Jun 8, 2019 at 7:58 am
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    I saw several 2017 re-drafts, Lias was not the Rangers’ pick in any of them, lol.

    But he did go around 13-15, so it’s not like he dropped out of the first round.

  • Jun 8, 2019 at 9:00 am
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    Buffalo Sabres signed Jeff Skinner to an 8 year, $72 M contract. Wow that’s a heck of a deal for the guy!!!!

    • Jun 8, 2019 at 9:18 am
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      7 years at $11M per for Panarin, that’s the deal that gets it done, IMO. And if the Rangers offer it, I think he will come.

      Unless the Rangers can trade for his rights and be able to give him the 8th year, which is a very real possibility.

      • Jun 8, 2019 at 9:26 am
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        Tony

        Let’s say the deal is done, and we trade for Trouba, and sign him to a very large contract what then? We become the Pens, or the Lightning, where we have a two tier system in play. Top end guys get overpaid, the rest of the team gets as little as management can get away with. Me, I’d prefer to see a deeper team, with quality up, and down the lineup. I could be way out of line here, but that’s my thought process!!!!!!!!

        • Jun 8, 2019 at 9:42 am
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          Walt, based on what I know, if it comes down to Panarin or Trouba, then Panarin is the choice.

          He is, by far and away, the most desired acquisition for the Rangers this year. As I said the other day, there are not many seasons where such an elite star is available, so the Rangers will try to get it done.

          So if Trouba or Hamilton or whomever is added to the D, then Staal, Smith, and/or Shatty have to be cap casualties: Staal can be bought out, Smith can be demoted to Hartford, and Shatty can be traded with 50% cap retainage.

          Guess what? Now the Rangers can easily afford both Panarin and Trouba. Make no mistake, these 2 players ARE the targets for the Rangers. Whether it works out is a different story, but this is the focus of their attention. They just don’t want to make the playoffs next year, they think that they can contend with the additions of those 2 players (in addition to what’s already coming), and I agree with them.

          Walt, you do not win without elite talent, end of story.

          • Jun 8, 2019 at 10:00 am
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            Yep Mika needs help…Him and Trouba and we are a playoff team

          • Jun 8, 2019 at 10:23 am
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            Tony

            I agree with everything you said, but with all the good young kids coming along, and to retain them down the road, 3-4 years or so, I just don’t want to be in a cap hell. All the contenders have cap issues, and some, like the Leafs, Lightning, Pens, have to maybe get rid of quality people to get within the cap. I hate to think that we draft, develop, and then lose very good players because of cap issues. I guess that’s the cost of doing business, and that’s why JD, JG get the big pay day!!!

            By the way, I’m all on board for getting rid of the dead wood, they are a huge boat anchor on the ankle of management………..

            • Jun 8, 2019 at 3:59 pm
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              Well, here’s an update Walt, just hearing today that JD is going to be patient and not bend to make any kind of deals or contracts.

              So while Panarin and Trouba are the targets, the Rangers may not go far enough to actually get them.

              Panarin will get a max deal and if his rights are traded, that team can give him 8 years. It sounds like the Rangers are not doing that. So…

              • Jun 8, 2019 at 6:48 pm
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                Tony

                Interesting, having Panarin playing for him, he may know something that would sway him from trying to sign the guy??????

                I think that may be a good idea after all, wait till next season, get Trouba then, and see what areas need improvement after the new kids arrive. He’s in no hurry it seems………..

              • Jun 9, 2019 at 5:32 am
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                It’s not the player Walt, it’s the contract that they would have to give him, that JD may not want to do.

                Panarin is getting a max deal of either 7 years or 8 years at $11M/$12M per. If the Rangers want no part of that, which is looking like they might not, then Panarin is not coming here, no matter how much he wants to play here (and he does). It’s that simple.

                Make no mistake, Panarin and the Rangers want each other, but “want” does not a deal make. The Panarin/Bob package to FL is a real possibility. Stay tuned.

              • Jun 9, 2019 at 8:39 am
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                Tony

                If Panarin really wants here, then he makes some concessions, it’s called negotiations. MSG, working with their advertisers can assure him additional income to make up the difference. Let’s face it, where else other than LA can you get with marketing companies who are that well connected? We’ll see what happens, but I can go with, or without the guy, he’s very good, but he’s not elite. That term is thrown out there like candy. He isn’t worth more than Crosby, Mc David, Mathews, Ovie, Stamkos and others in that stratosphere!!!!!!!!

              • Jun 9, 2019 at 10:26 am
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                Walt, I will say this, it appears to be between the Rangers and the Panthers.

                If Bob goes to the Panthers then there is a good chance that Panarin goes with him. Their significant others are best friends.

                So it would make sense that if they can land in the same spot AND get their money AND be at the beach AND be in a highly populated Russian area AND not have to pay state taxes on more than half their games, then that is very tough for the Rangers to match, not giving Panarin a max contract offer.

                The Rangers’ draw? MSG, NYC, beaches, Russian population, but the ladies will not be together (don’t discount that factor). So offering less $$ than FL will “probably” result in not getting the player the Rangers mst have, IMO.

              • Jun 10, 2019 at 11:43 pm
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                Team that trades for his rights can only offer 7 years.

          • Jun 8, 2019 at 12:08 pm
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            Sorry, but if they were going to lay out that kind of money ($11M), Rangers missed their chance when Mark Stone signed with Vegas. Let’s not any big bets right now – we simply aren’t that close to a Cup…….

            • Jun 8, 2019 at 4:02 pm
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              If the Rangers added Panarin, Trouba, the yong players that are coming anyway, and shed the dead wood, they absolutely could be in the conversation.

              Who is on STL that the Rangers coldn’t match? After getting those players?

              • Jun 8, 2019 at 4:29 pm
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                Binnington

              • Jun 8, 2019 at 5:09 pm
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                We can match that.

      • Jun 9, 2019 at 12:33 am
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        $11m to play in NYC? Screw that. A smart guy can parlay NYC into a wealth of opportunities — besides, you get to be in the City with a whole lot of money in your pocket, can’t think of anything better than that. No sorry, either he leaves a few $s on the table or forget him. Let him play in Florida where the sun makes people stupid and where more than half the fans are Ranger fans. He’ll never be all that he can be in Florida … and he won’t win a Cup. 7 years takes him to 35, let me know how you feel about those $11m when he’s 32+.

        Oh and Trouba, he can take $8m per to play in NY, his wife will make up the difference and then some being a doctor in NYC. 😉

        • Jun 9, 2019 at 5:38 am
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          It’s my humble opinion that Panarin will be productive for most of his next contract.

          I feel like his “game” is conducive to long-term sustainability.

          He’s a great player and a near “franchise” player. When there’s an opportunity to get a guy like this, in the position that the Rangers are in right now, I feel like they should pull the trigger.

          Moves can be easily made to clear cap space for now and going forward.

          And yes, Mrs. Trouba does want NYC to promote her own business, lol.

          • Jun 10, 2019 at 11:45 pm
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            Below average height and weight, not an elite skater.

            None of that suggests he will beat the aging curve.

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